Multae Sententiae is Latin for "many thoughts". Free thinking leads to Enlightenment. Enlightenment leads to happiness...

The-Brights.net

Thursday, March 30, 2006 CE

Solution for illegal immigration problem


The issue of the illegal immigrants in th United States is a very complex one. Some sort of solution has to be found so that the legality problem is solved without affecting the human rights of people who is working. Here is a set of measures that I am proposing, just let me know what you think.

1. Close the border to illegal immigration starting tomorrow. Declare any new person who crosses illegally a felon and deport him/her immediately.

2. Give a 90-180 day notice for the 12 million illegal immigrants living in the country to report themselves to the authorities.

3. When reporting themselves, the illegal person should bring documentation showing that he or she has a job. Employers will be in the obligation to provide that documentation and will be assured that no measures would be taken against them. After that, the immigrant would be issued an ID card and would be given the assurance that they can remain in the country. The employers should start paying benefits.

4. Illegal immigrants who are unable to provide documentation of a job, should be deported immediately. In the case of a family composed of two parents and children, at least one parent should be working to avoid deportation for the whole family.

5. After the 90 or 180 day period, if an illegal immigrant does not have an ID card, he or she should be deported immediately. No new ID cards will be issued after the 90-180 day period. People on student/working visas should always carry proof of it(including myself)

6. If, after a certain period of years, the immigrant (who would not be illegal anymore) is able to be always employed, he should be eligible for citizenship.

7. Crimes commited by the immigrant would mean immediate deportation.

8. After the 90-180 day period, to employ an illegal immigrant without an ID card would also be considered a felony.

9. A national ID card would have to be issued in order to avoid inconvenient situations with citizens of the US or with legal immigrants.



Many of this measures are hard to apply, but they would assure that the illegal immigrants who are working as nannies or at the fields would remain in the country, would have a legal status and a pathway to citizenship. Productive people will stay. Employers will have responsabilities. There would always be abusive employers that would blackmail the immigrants, however, they would not have many people to choose from, so they would have to care for their workers.

The issue of the national ID card is also a difficult one, but, if there is going to be a solution to illegal immigration, all citizens would have to participate. We have to remember that we are talking about 4% of the current US population.

26 Comments:

Blogger doc-t said...

While I do not necessarily agree with all of you post, I do appreciate that you, unlike most who blog about a problem, offer up a possible solution.

1: You say close the border to illegal immigration. That's already done. and any illegal alien found in the U.S. is supposed to be deported.

2: What would be their motivation for reporting themselves? If there is not a %100 chance they will get to stay, they're not likely to report themselves, are they?

3: The jobs that many illegal alliens have do not lend themselves to evidence by documentation. They are paid cash under the table. many in our society take advantage of illegal aliens by offering this poor wages with no benefits.

4: See number 3. that being the case, they quite simply are NOT going to report themselves.

The only ones who WILL report are those who have somehow illegally found valid jobs. The rest will remain as is. They are NOT gong to report just to be deported.

6: Making employment a requirement for citizenship violates the concept of life, liberty, and the persuit of happiness.

woudl society be better off? Maybe. and I would like to see everyone able to support themselves, but to demand more of immigrants than we do of ourselves is unfair.

7: If the immigrant is NOT a U.S. citizen, AND the crime is a felon, then yes, by all means deport them.

9: Very practical, but a violation of civil liberties. I'm caught in the middle with this one. I see nothing wrong, really, with having a card that states who you are.


The united states is a melting pot. Our forefathers were kicked out of every decent country in the world...

Then, there are a few of us, our forefathers were here first. We are not the ones in power. Odd, considering the current discussions on illegal immigrants.

I am Hawaiin. should I have more rights than descendents of non-indigenous residents of the U.S?

well, no. The same should be said by descendents of irish, english, chinese, japanese, african, australian, german, french... immigrants.

3:54 AM  
Blogger Doctor Marco said...

Thanks for your comment. The idea of the post is to generate debate, because, evidently, something has to be done.

1. When I say close the border I mean to close it seriously, not like now that people is able to sneak in. It means to place a real force patrolling and checking the border.

2. The motivation for reporting would be the pathway to citizenship.

3. The responsability of the documents would be on the employers.

4. If they do not report, it would be a matter of choice. A campaign using TV, newspaper and radio would show people reporting themselves and getting the benefits of it. The fact that I say that one one member of a famlily would be required to report sems pretty benign.

6. Remember that the illegal immigrant is already citizen of another country. He is not at risk of not having a nation.

9. I have always had a national ID card. It is not that bad. Currently, the government does not need a national ID card to know everything about us. I think it would help, but , it is a matter of debate.

6:39 AM  
Blogger Truth Seeker said...

Marco,

I'm a little suprised by your "toughness" on this. I'm curious about your motivation even though you say debate about a real problem is the motivation. I believe you, but what do you think the real problem is? Fair treatment? Unfair treatment? Making it tougher for terrorists to enter the U.S.? Something else?

. . .

Having lived in South Texas for 50 years, being around, and working with illegal Mexican immigrants is very comfortable for me. They are good people. Humble. Friendly.

Generally speaking they do quite well here. Many Americans consider them to be living in poverty, but most are doing much better than those they left behind in Mexico.

Our public hospitals provide them with fair to ok, free (taxes) health care. Our schools educate their children in Spanish and English for free (taxes). Our police protect them thought not as well as they protect me. There are Spanish radio stations for their entertainment. Ditto TV. Ditto newspapers. Grocery stores have many products intented specifically for them (HEB is well known for this). Their housing is poor and I would not want to live in the houses they live in, but they are better than the homes they had in Mexico. So, in addition to being paid what they consider to be a fair or even a lucrative wage, our local society augments their pay with support services. Which, after all, seems only fair since lour society as a whole benefits from them, not just the employer.

The saddest thing to me is that 5% to 10% of the immigrants give this whole system a black eye. The Mexican drug runners and pushers are very violent. Mexican crime rings here are small but are very bad. Auto theft is rampant. Propery owners along the border have no privacy, and many of them have very serious security concerns.

The next saddest thing is our political system - the party system. The Democrats can't seem to wait to boost their minority vote - a whole group of new poor people that they think will vote to redistribute wealth in America in exchange for giving the Democrats power. The Republicans can't seem to wait to boost their religious vote - a whole group of Catholics that they think will vote for Christian religious ideals in exchange for giving the Republicans power. The world will always be divided into "have nots" and the "haves". The "haves" will attempt to hold on to it with all of their power. The "have nots" will attempt to get some using all of their power. The U.S. is next to a whole country of "have nots". We have an informal system that has been very beneficial to stakeholders on both sides of the border for hundreds of years. Now here comes the politics. Here comes the racism. Here comes the fear. To me, the press accentuates the conflict by showing us the most emotional stories.

My one and only concern is the impact of too many immigrants coming to the U.S. in a short period of time. Our, and every society, is designed so that the average person can succeed. If we have too many immigrants that have skills and knowledge below the current U.S. average it will lower our society skillset as a whole. If managed, we will be ok. In fact, we will be great because we will have a whole new group of people that bring energy to our society/country. We will have a small, short-term drop followed by a big boost once the immigrants assimilate. If however, they aren't able to assimilate, we will have a decline in our society that potentially never turns into a boost.

Q

12:30 PM  
Blogger Doctor Marco said...

Q:

There is nothing to be surprised of. One half of the full force of the hypothetical measures I proposed are directed towards the illegals who do not work. They are probably the least of the 11-12 million, lets say a 10%. The rest, probably 90%, need to get a better share from the society they are serving with their hard work. The other half of the full force is directed towards the abusive employers that take advantage of the illegal status of the immigrants to "save some money". Since it is a huge issue, created by the authorities and, indirectly, by the people who elected them, all have to contribute something towards the solution. Let me add also that the Mexican government needs to be included also in the solution and I am sure that the US has means of putting perssure on them

3:53 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

This is an email I was sent, I was asked to put it as a comment because they had trouble with blogger.

Drop the Borders! From the Arctic to Tierra del Fuego!

Easier said than done, to be sure! The OAS's members would no doubt have self-servient interests that would impede such a thing from ever taking place.

The European Common community may have its problems, and it may not even last, but something along these lines is gonna have to take place.

The US and Canada cannot continue with isolationist, imperialistic special interest style policies at a time when globalization of markets and economies is taking place.

The rich get richer, as has been the case from the beginning of time. The Latinos, it would seem, are forced to fight over the "crumbs that fall off of the table."

Granted, the "Machismo" of Latin and South American governments will clash with the arrogance of my government, but once we can overcome the semantics things will begin to really take shape.

A vast consumer market is awaiting our goods and products. We need not fear this. We must use this to our mutual advantage.

"He who neglects the cries of the poor and oppressed will have his own cries ignored in his time of need."

Beto

8:29 AM  
Blogger Doctor Marco said...

Beto:

I agree with you in that integration should be a goal. I actually believe in a global economic and political union. One government for the whole planet. However, the current situation, in which, for example, illegal immigrants have to rely on the ER's for healthcare because they do not have insurance, the abuses of the employers who use the illegal status for their own benefits and the creation of an undereducated young population (who end up in unemployement and probably crime)product of the lack of access to proper education are issues that should not be accepted. The only way of doing in it ensuring a flow of legal immigration that is suited to the needs of the country and that will increase standard of living of people who work so hard.

8:39 AM  
Blogger Truth Seeker said...

Marco,

Found this in a Treasury & Risk magazine. Thought it might interest you.

TALK ABOUT ALTERNATIVE ENERGY ISN'T JUST HOT AIR ANYMORE

The entire article may be viewed at http://www.treasuryandrisk.com/issues/2006_03/risk_management/506-1.html
March 2006
By Duncan Wood

Here's the thing. There are people on both sides of every topic. You have to decide which ones you trust. I prefer my source from Shell because I know him personnaly. I've had the chance to look him in the eye when I ask my questions and he answered them. Doesn't prove a thing. But better than most...

Q

3:05 PM  
Blogger Nog said...

How about a more simple solution?

1. Get dismantle and or privatize all domestic welfare programs.

2. Allow anyone who wants to come the United States for peaceful reasons to do so.

10:52 PM  
Blogger Doctor Marco said...

Truth Seeker (Q)

If you do not mind I will cut and paste your comment in the comment section of my post related to Peak Oil

Nog

Thanks for your comment. The problem of welfare is only partially related to the problem of illegal immigration. I do not know if your solution will create more problems than the currently existing

11:13 PM  
Blogger Sherril said...

Hi Marco,
I am commenting on your blog from Israel. I have posted from here also. Take a look.

Perhaps the answer to our Immigration problem is the same answer that some give to the problems of Prostitution and Drug use. That asnwer is LEGALIZE IT. It is much easier to fix problems when the underlying cause is not in and of itself, the legality issue. Perhaps if it were legal to get into this country, but the regulations were more more strictly enforced, we could allow people in who were to find work in a given amount of time and who obeyed the laws of the land. If they are found to break serious laws, they would be sent back to their countries. If they could not find work, again they would be sent back. I don't mean to overly simplify the problems, but this is one solution that ought to be considered. However, I know that Conservative people do not want to legalize Prostituion or Drugs, and I am pretty certain they will not want to legalize Immigration, as well. BUT, they won't always be in power....will they???

Sherril
שרונה
Sharona

9:29 AM  
Blogger Doctor Marco said...

Sherril

You think like me, I just try to give it a more viable form.

I will see your site!

9:31 PM  
Blogger Diane S. said...

First, I have to mention that I just read a comment of yours on another blog. The comment let me know English is not your native language, so I have to stop and express my admiration at your command of our language. I'm actually amazed you are not a native speaker.

Immigration is such a tangled issue. A person's stance on immigration usually says a lot about their stance on racial issues, on social welfare issues, and their willingness (or unwillingness) to evaluate people and the way they should be treated in a society strictly in terms of their economic contributions.

One thing that I think we need to be very clear on, is that in America, when we are discussing immigration, we are discussing minority immigration. No one gives a damn about how many white Western Europeans come into the country. There is no outcry against them (though I will stipulate there was a time when the Irish were an exception to this).

These are the things I feel:

I have a lot of hispanic friends. I love them. I've also learned a lot about hispanic culture from them, and I've come to value that culture very much - even as I recognize that there are ways in which that culture is very different, and sometimes even diametrically opposed to the prevailing white culture in America.

Because of this, I feel incredibly protective of my hispanic friends, their families, and their communities. I see the current immigration debate as an attack on all of this, and it scares me and makes me angry.

These are the things I know:

Illegal immigrants in America take jobs that Americans simply will not do.

Keeping bomb lobbing, or plane hijacking terrorists out of the U.S. has become an actual issue, and we need to find a reasonable way to address it.

People come here for all sorts of reasons. Some are looking for economic opportunity. Some are fleeing oppressive governments. Some - it is true - are looking to "work the system". I believe the last group is a tiny minority, but I can't deny that it exists.

These are my tentative political opinions on the issues:

I tend to agree with Sherill on this. Not just on the immigration, but on the legalization of prostitution and drugs.

Somewhere there is a delicate balance between evaluating people in terms of their economic worth and weeding out people who are merely trying to exploit a system which was established as an act of compassion (it's continued existance as a means of compassion is open to debate, but that's another post and another comment.)

Where this balance exists, I am not entirely sure, but I hope with all my heart that we find it. I hope that America can continue to be a place where multi-culturalism is embraced. I hope we can continue to be a place where people can come to better their lives, to find refuge from oppression, and to make a good life for themselves and their families.

8:01 PM  
Blogger Doctor Marco said...

Diane S

Thanks for the nice words. I agree that there is a delicate balance to keep. The question is: Does Amerca want to keep the issue as it is? If yes, lets leave it like that. If no, lets propose solutions.

8:27 PM  
Blogger Truth Seeker said...

Marco,

As far as I'm concerned our comments are public domain - and therefore reusable.

Q

9:15 AM  
Blogger Alanita said...

The American attempt to slow the pace of immigration is an understandable one: after all, the United States cannot afford to feed and protect the entire world. But because of its status as "a nation of immigrants" it is hard to say that only the immigrants lucky enough to have immigrated to the U.S. before the twentieth century can have the opportunity to better themselves.
However, we have an American Contradiction: the Statue of Liberty no longer is the welcome mat out for ``your tired, your poor, Your huddled masses . . . .''
Foreigners are less welcome precisely because they are perceived as tired and poor and huddled when the public identifies poverty with indolence and sees the barrio as the cause of many ills.
To go along with your ideas, Dr. Marco, I think the following things would need to be implemented: We should invest in better enforcement to reduce undocumented immigration, both at the border and by investigative follow-up, and we should monitor that system to improve its efficiency. We should hire more examiners and immigration judges, if necessary, to dispose of the asylum and deportation cases, which now remain on the docket largely because of an institutional failure to adjudicate. The message to be sent is that we will vigorously police our borders, and enforce deportation, not that we will act in a way unbecoming to a sensible.
In a nutshell, it is likely that the anti-immigrant sentiment in America is due to a cultural rather than economic threat. Many "native" Americans fear that because of the large influx of Latin Americans into the United States, of which Mexicans are the majority, their way of life is threatened. This "threat" is due to the language barrier and the distinct cultural differences of the incoming immigrants. America’s citizens must learn to be more tolerant of immigration as a whole for if they look at their own family trees they will discover that their families, too, are immigrant families.
Viva la tierra del fuego! :)

3:43 PM  
Anonymous Cassandra said...

This is a very interesting thread. I have to admit that I have no idea what I think should be done. It seems that no matter what, someone is getting the "shit end of the stick."
At one point in my life (while living in CA) I was very pro-immigration and even pro-illegal alien (if you know what I mean...). I worked with quite a few illegal aliens while living there and they were, by far, the most responsible, hardest working people I had ever met.
That said, having open borders would absolutely destroy our economy. I would hate to see that happen.

One of the obvious actions to take is to help Mexico become a thriving country. They are our neighbors. We need to help Mexico become a modern country and help weed out the corruption. That's not an easy task to take on, but a necessary one in the long run.

2:32 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I ssupport the idea of opening up the borders. America was built by immigrants and continues to thrive necause of immigrants. Open up the borders and let your neighbors enjoy the free markets and let there be flow of wealth! You idea of opening up the entire planet is not practical. Borders can be opened up only across close groups of countries.

Opening up the MExican and Candian borders will pose a lot of short term problems but is the only long term solution! America has the wealth and knowledge to manage open borders. In the long run wealth wil flow from high level areas to the lower lying areas and people will stay put where ever they are happy!

venkatesh

11:48 PM  
Blogger Doctor Marco said...

Alanita:

I see that we agree, just using different wording.

6:37 PM  
Blogger Doctor Marco said...

Cassandra:

The US has to work with Mexico, that is a great truth. If Mexico's economy starts to grow, there might not be a need for Mexicans to cross the border illegally.

6:41 PM  
Blogger Doctor Marco said...

Venkatesh

I think that there is a cultural problem. Many people in America really do not like the way immigrantss approach life, their language or their social background. At the same time, many immigrants do not want to insert themselves in the American culture. They choose to live exactly as they live in their countries of origin.

6:50 PM  
Anonymous Brock Tice said...

You assume that employers will provide documentation, eventually leading to their payment of benefits, which they won't want to do.

Thus, they won't provide documentation.

I like your approach but I see this as a problem. Your thoughts on a way around this?

6:13 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

wow, harsh ideas from someone who just arrived 4 yrs ago, from a latino country nonetheless, it is obvious you do not know your place in this great Land

You are fighting a cause that is not yours.. I assume you have some identity issues my friend, seek help

2:14 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Dear Doctor Marco,

Let me start by mentioning that this country was founded by immigrants and that most of us, except for native americans, have a foreign origin, either europen, african, asian, hispanic, etc.

Some families migrated more than 100 years ago and some less than a month ago, and lets not forget that maybe grandpa or grandpa's grandpa probably came from a different country to our country to provide a better life for themselves and for their families, and therefore we should sensitive to this problem.

However, this country is also based on rules and laws and regulations.

The laws are very clear regarding foreigners and they are very simple and easy to understand: To enter (and stay) in the USA, the foreign citizen should have an authorization issued by the US government. It is that simple.

There are many legal ways to get an authorization, you can get a visa (tourist, student, work, training, etc) or a permanent residency ( i.e. green card).

There are millions of LEGAL immigrants in this country, who study and work hard, who followed the rules applied and waited in their home countries for a visa, or had to go to rural areas of the country in order to get a green card, people who wanted to come to this country as well, but the big difference is that they respected the law and followed the proper channels. What about them? Do you think that it would be fair for them? Do you think that the one who followed the rules and the one who cheated should get the same prize? I dont think so.

I believe that every person that wants to enter the country MUST be authorized to do so prior their arrival ( and not the other way around).

Having said this, I think that people who are in the country without a visa or a permit, have already broken the law and therefore should be considered criminals and treated like that. The penalties determined by law should be imposed.

I am not saying that illegal immigrants are bad people. Not at all. Most of them are very hardworking people, usually very kind, humble and friendly. Most of them have very strong family values that I share and respect and I want to make it clear that I dont have anything against them. Unfortunately, they have broken the law, the same way, somebody who drives with an expired license is at fault.

I dont think that illegal immigrants should be rewarded for breaking the law by receiving a visa or permit. If we decide to to so, why do we have laws in the first place? It would defeat the whole purpose of rules and laws and regulations and society would be complete chaos. If we do this, we should post signs at the international airports that read "TO ENTER THE USA YOU MUST HAVE PROPER AUTHORIZATION (well, not really)". It would be like arresting a guy for a DUI and instead of getting a ticket, the police officer buys him a beer..... and we can just not afford to do that. It is a matter of the principle of authority and law that is essential for society.

Every single person that crossed the border illegally, knew that they were breaking the law, they knew the benefits and the risks of this action, and therefore should be accounted and take responsibility for their actions. They knew that if they were caught, they would have to return to their home country, the same way a guy who steals a bank knows that if caught will end up in jail.

We make this kind of decisions every single day in life, do I do this or not?, do I take take the risk or not?, etc, etc.

Why do you want to make them legal?

Dont you think that they should return to their countries and wait in line at the US Embassy and apply for a visa, or if they dont want to leave, maybe go to the Immigration Services offices in the US and discuss each case on an individual basis with a goverment official and accept what he/she decides?

Dont you think it would be a slap on the face for all those LEGAL foreigners who do follow the rules?

Dont you think it sets a bad example for children about authority and rules and may reinforce other illegal activities ("I will just break the law, maybe they will give a break too")?

Dont you think that it is not moral to "sell" the US citizenship? "if you have a job and make so much money and you PAY the goverment so much money, you get a citizenship" The last time I checked on ebay, i could not find any citizenships for sale. People can not buy a citizenship, they have to earn it, the same way you did not buy your Medical Degree, you earned it, with hard work and playing by the rules.

Are you aware of the billions of dollars of health cost for ER visits? I disagree with you that it is the "abusive employers" fault. Nobody is being forced to accept a job, again, they wager their options , the good and bad of the offer, and make a decision and THEY should be responsible for it, not the employer.

Why do you think of the employer as the bad guy? Maybe he is the good guy, providing a salary and a job that will support a family. I am sure that most of the immigrants are grateful to their bosses for giving them the opportunity to work.

I think that illegal immigrants should be treated with respect and dignity but lets not forget that they broke the law and should be held accountable for it.

2:21 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I like chocolate milk

11:42 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

and family guy is cool

11:47 AM  
Blogger Marcus said...

We have an interesting debate going on the immigration issue at:

http://www.surveymagnet.com/2010/08/is-it-possible-to-end-the-immigration-problem-in-the-us/

Come join the discussion.

1:52 PM  

Post a Comment

<< Home

web page tracking
Dell Laptops Computers
Content copyright protected by Copyscape website plagiarism search